Evinrude Junior outboard motor...

[Al D]

I stumbled accross an old Evinrude Junior outboard motor today in a
local chandlers: asking price £60. They assure me it's in good working
order. It looks like it's well over 10 years old. I have the option of
taking it back if I'm not happy. Research tells me it's probably 2hp.
Does this sound like a good deal? I want it to power a 14ft open
canoe. Have never owned an outboard motor before. Can anyone give me
any tips on faults to look out for, or where I can obtain an owner's
manual or any such helpful info? The guy in the shop says "you just
put fuel in (50:1) and off you go; there's nothing much else to worry
about." He says I can lay it flat in the boot of my car when it's not
in use. Is that correct?

Thanks for any info...

Al D

[chris]

Post by Al D
I stumbled accross an old Evinrude Junior outboard motor today in a
local chandlers: asking price £60. They assure me it's in good working
order. It looks like it's well over 10 years old. I have the option of
taking it back if I'm not happy. Research tells me it's probably 2hp.
Does this sound like a good deal? I want it to power a 14ft open
canoe. Have never owned an outboard motor before. Can anyone give me
any tips on faults to look out for, or where I can obtain an owner's
manual or any such helpful info? The guy in the shop says "you just
put fuel in (50:1) and off you go; there's nothing much else to worry
about." He says I can lay it flat in the boot of my car when it's not
in use. Is that correct?
Thanks for any info...
Al D

Old or neglected outboards often have bolts seized in the aluminium castings
so tight they break if you attempt to move them. Make sure all the moveable
bits such as tilt and turn motions work ok as well as the starter. You
don't seem to have much to lose if you get it on a sale or return basis for
say a week. Proprietary spares are unlikely to be supported after 7 years.
Make sure you give it a good run under load while it's returnable.
ChrisR

[Ronald Raygun]

Post by Al D
I stumbled accross an old Evinrude Junior outboard motor today in a
local chandlers: asking price £60.

That looks like a good deal.

Post by Al D
They assure me it's in good working order.

That sounds good.

Post by Al D
It looks like it's well over 10 years old.

Doesn't it have a serial number plate? It may well have the year
of manufacture printed on it. But don't be put off by age. It will
have a lot of experience, which is always valuable if you haven't.

Post by Al D
I have the option of taking it back if I'm not happy.

Very good.

Post by Al D
Research tells me it's probably 2hp.

Doesn't it say on the maker's plate?

Post by Al D
Does this sound like a good deal?

Absolutely. It's less than some workshops charge just for servicing one.

Post by Al D
I want it to power a 14ft open canoe.

My 2hp struggles to shift an 8ft rubber dinghy, but I guess your canoe
is probably easier to shift. Obviously you'd have to mount it to one
side. I guess that means you'll need not only a counterweight of some
sort on the other side (a box for your anchor and chain, perhaps?), but
constructing a stick-out false transom will need a fair bit of thought.

One thing, though. Don't let your 220m of anchor twine anywhere near
the propellor.

[Arturo Ui]

Post by Ronald Raygun
My 2hp struggles to shift an 8ft rubber dinghy, but I guess your canoe
is probably easier to shift. Obviously you'd have to mount it to one
side. I guess that means you'll need not only a counterweight of some
sort on the other side (a box for your anchor and chain, perhaps?), but
constructing a stick-out false transom will need a fair bit of thought.

Blimey, your inflatable must weigh loads - I've used a Seagull 40+ (2hp) on
my E-Boat and although it isn't fast, it goes alright!

Post by Ronald Raygun
One thing, though. Don't let your 220m of anchor twine anywhere near
the propellor.

Wise move... I wonder how you hang an outboard on a pointy canoe's stern?
Maybe it'll counterbalance the 10kg CQR at the bow!

Artie

[Floatything]

Post by Arturo Ui

Post by Ronald Raygun
My 2hp struggles to shift an 8ft rubber dinghy, but I guess your canoe
is probably easier to shift. Obviously you'd have to mount it to one
side. I guess that means you'll need not only a counterweight of some
sort on the other side (a box for your anchor and chain, perhaps?), but
constructing a stick-out false transom will need a fair bit of thought.

Blimey, your inflatable must weigh loads - I've used a Seagull 40+ (2hp) on
my E-Boat and although it isn't fast, it goes alright!

Post by Ronald Raygun
One thing, though. Don't let your 220m of anchor twine anywhere near
the propellor.

Wise move... I wonder how you hang an outboard on a pointy canoe's stern?
Maybe it'll counterbalance the 10kg CQR at the bow!
Artie

Er... I'm afraid I have to admit doing this in January, dressed as bo
peep....
let me explain... I entered into the Lerryn Seagull Race - which is a fun
race up the river Lerryn - in any vessel (tub/floating pallet/rubber
ring/etc) as long as it is powered by one or more Seagull outboards (some
had ten seagulls!).

I and a friend made a simple wooden frame to hold a 40+ seagull off the port
quarter of a canadian (kneel in) canoe.

It went like s**t off a shovel! BUT... stable it was not. At the point of
revving the surge of raw power that you get from a seagull attempted to flip
the canoe over to starboard. When the leg of the o/b touched ground it
tried to flip the other way.

We found the best way to deal with this was to crouch low (Cresta run style)
to keep the COG low and to prepare for the Seagulls attempts to flip us
over.

Turning was the other problem - 17 foot of narrow hull is not easily turned
by an outboard at the stern - and any thought of turning the tiller to 90
degrees were quickly dashed by experience.

As for balancing the hull - well I did have a roll of roofing lead on the
opposite side - but it only really helped when stationary.

Floatything

[Al D]

On Tue, 20 Jun 2006 15:18:23 GMT, Ronald Raygun

Post by Ronald Raygun
Doesn't it have a serial number plate?

Yes, it does, it states:
Mod No. BEJRCCM
Ser No. 1641089

Post by Ronald Raygun
It may well have the year

Nosirree, it doesn't... But my guess is at least 20 yrs old on closer
examination.

Post by Ronald Raygun
Doesn't it say on the maker's plate?

No - but I googled for Evinrude Junior and 2hp kept coming up; nothing
else.

Post by Ronald Raygun

Post by Al D
Does this sound like a good deal?

Absolutely. It's less than some workshops charge just for servicing one.

Great.. thanks for confirming that!

Post by Ronald Raygun

Post by Al D
I want it to power a 14ft open canoe.

My 2hp struggles to shift an 8ft rubber dinghy, but I guess your canoe
is probably easier to shift. Obviously you'd have to mount it to one
side. I guess that means you'll need not only a counterweight of some
sort on the other side (a box for your anchor and chain, perhaps?), but
constructing a stick-out false transom will need a fair bit of thought.

I went to my local canoe shop and asked to see an outboard motor
bracket. The chap showed me a photo. The price was £50. And it was
made of some dubious wood that looked like pine. So I picked up some
offcuts of teak from a local boatbuilder and will simply make my own.
It's pretty simple thing: a board that clamps accross the gunwales and
has an upright bit on it to clamp the motor to.

Post by Ronald Raygun
One thing, though. Don't let your 220m of anchor twine anywhere near
the propellor.

LOL, good idea. ...except that I took your advice and settled for a
shorter length of nylon braided rope and some chain. Actually, I'm
more concerned about the muddy silt on the estuary bed. I'm even
thinking of mounting the motor higher than usual so that the prop is
above the level of the bottom of the hull so that (a) the prop doesn't
foul on the crud on the river bed and (b) I am less likely to get
flipped over when doing a turn (a danger that motorised canoeists keep
mentioning).

Al D

[Pete Verdon]

I'm even thinking of mounting the motor higher than usual so that the prop is
above the level of the bottom of the hull

If you do that, make sure the water intake is well below the surface,
both at rest and at speed. Bear in mind also that being too close to the
surface will affect the flow round the prop - cavitation and so forth.

Pete

[Tony Cook]

Post by Al D
LOL, good idea. ...except that I took your advice and settled for a
shorter length of nylon braided rope and some chain. Actually, I'm
more concerned about the muddy silt on the estuary bed. I'm even
thinking of mounting the motor higher than usual so that the prop is
above the level of the bottom of the hull so that (a) the prop doesn't
foul on the crud on the river bed and (b) I am less likely to get
flipped over when doing a turn (a danger that motorised canoeists keep
mentioning).
Al D

Aplogies for the snip. The engine sounds like a real snip to me, if you
change your mind I'll take it off your hands and give you a little
profit into the bargain.

I'm not a canoist so this bit is pure theory, i.e, woolly thinking, but
assuming the engine has a standard, short, shaft I wouldn't mount it
anything like as high as you suggest. Quite apart from cavitation as
mentioned by others you would stand to reduce the effectiveness of the
engine to a ridiculous extent.

I would have thought that making use of the tilt, assuming it works
which of course you should check, would be effective in shoal conditions
while in deeper water you will at some stage want all the thrust you can
safely get.

Assuming that you keep the mounting arm on the side of the canoe as
short as you practicably can I would not think that the weight of the
engine would have too serious an unbalancing effect on you.

As regards flipping over in a turn I don't think this is likely to be a
real problem if you are not maniac enough to manouver at full throttle.

Then again if you are youl'l be getting just the surprise you deserve.

Try turning at the shift gear throttle setting initially and gradually
work up untill experience tells you when you have enough power on.

Tony Cook

[Al D]

Post by Tony Cook
Aplogies for the snip. The engine sounds like a real snip to me, if you
change your mind I'll take it off your hands and give you a little
profit into the bargain.
I'm not a canoist so this bit is pure theory, i.e, woolly thinking, but
assuming the engine has a standard, short, shaft I wouldn't mount it
anything like as high as you suggest. Quite apart from cavitation as
mentioned by others you would stand to reduce the effectiveness of the
engine to a ridiculous extent.
I would have thought that making use of the tilt, assuming it works
which of course you should check, would be effective in shoal conditions

The only thing that concerned me is that the propellor guard (in front
of the prop) is merely a blade which I guess would slice right into
the shoal or whatever before it starts to tilt the motor. But I'm
guessing that the worst that would then happen (in most cases) would
be that the engine might stall (being only 2 hp). Any comemnts on
that?

The way I have so far constructed the mounting bracket, the bottom of
the propellor will be exactly 7 inches beloww the bottom of the hull.
Does that sound like a good depth?

Post by Tony Cook
while in deeper water you will at some stage want all the thrust you can
safely get.
Assuming that you keep the mounting arm on the side of the canoe as
short as you practicably can I would not think that the weight of the
engine would have too serious an unbalancing effect on you.

No; nor do I; It's a lightweight engine, and my sitting a few inches
to one side would balance it out.

Post by Tony Cook
As regards flipping over in a turn I don't think this is likely to be a
real problem if you are not maniac enough to manouver at full throttle.
Then again if you are youl'l be getting just the surprise you deserve.
Try turning at the shift gear throttle setting initially and gradually
work up untill experience tells you when you have enough power on.

Thanks for the tip. I can see the throttle, but what is the the "shift
gear throttle setting"? Does this thing actually have some shiftable
gears in it, somehow?

Some other questions, if you (or anyone) would be kind enough:

1) There are two screw adjustments (one above the other) on the front
of what looks like the carburettor. What are they? Mixture screws? Any
idea which is which?

2) There appears to be a choke button which you can pull outwards.
Should this always be pulled out when starting the motor?

3) How should the throttle be set when starting the motor?

4) In the middle of the filler cap, there is a smaller 20mm diameter
unscrewable cap. I'm guessing this is to let air into the tank while
the engine is running. Is this correct?

5) at the moment, the fuel tank is absolutely empty and dry. After I
fill it, is there any tickling or anything to be done before
attempting to crank her up?

Sorry for the naive questions, but as I mentioned this is my first
outboard motor. In fact it's the first two-stroke engine of any kind
that I've ever owned.

Thanks again..

Al D

[Andy Champ]

Al D wrote:
<snip>

Post by Al D
LOL, good idea. ...except that I took your advice and settled for a
shorter length of nylon braided rope and some chain. Actually, I'm
more concerned about the muddy silt on the estuary bed. I'm even
thinking of mounting the motor higher than usual so that the prop is
above the level of the bottom of the hull so that (a) the prop doesn't
foul on the crud on the river bed and (b) I am less likely to get
flipped over when doing a turn (a danger that motorised canoeists keep
mentioning).

Putting it higher might even make the risk of flipping *greater* by
rasing the center of gravity of the entire vessel. Do motorised
canoeist flip to the inside or the outside of the turn?

If it really worries you - how about outriggers?

Andy

[Al D]

Post by Andy Champ
Putting it higher might even make the risk of flipping *greater* by
rasing the center of gravity of the entire vessel. Do motorised
canoeist flip to the inside or the outside of the turn?

The tendency is, (I can only assume), to flip over towards the inside
of the turn, because the thrust of the prop is below the center of
gravity. I cant see what forces could cause it to flip the other way.

Post by Andy Champ
If it really worries you - how about outriggers?

It doesn't worry me much. I will probably take the canoe out with the
motor in shallow water and find out just how it handles and what its
limitations are. After that, I'll know how far I can push it when
turning.

But, yes, the outrigger idea is always of interest. It's one of those
things I might get around to experimenting with one day - along with
sails, perhaps.

Cheers,

Al D

[Al D]

On Tue, 20 Jun 2006 15:18:23 GMT, Ronald Raygun

Post by Ronald Raygun
Doesn't it have a serial number plate? It may well have the year
of manufacture printed on it. But don't be put off by age.

Model # is: BEJRCCM which means it was manufactured in 1988.

I guess it's hard to obtain spares for such an 18-yr old engine, is
it?

Al D

[Ronald Raygun]

Post by Al D
On Tue, 20 Jun 2006 15:18:23 GMT, Ronald Raygun

Post by Ronald Raygun
Doesn't it have a serial number plate? It may well have the year
of manufacture printed on it. But don't be put off by age.

Model # is: BEJRCCM which means it was manufactured in 1988.
I guess it's hard to obtain spares for such an 18-yr old engine, is
it?

It's difficult to say. The design of these probably doesn't change
much over the years, apart from cosmetically. Even if it packs in
after a year or two, it's still good value at £60.

[Al D]

On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 08:41:07 GMT, Ronald Raygun

Post by Ronald Raygun

Post by Al D
I guess it's hard to obtain spares for such an 18-yr old engine, is
it?

It's difficult to say. The design of these probably doesn't change
much over the years, apart from cosmetically. Even if it packs in
after a year or two, it's still good value at £60.

Thank you. Unfortunately, we had trouble getting it running well
today. It ran for about 3 minutes and then died, and we couldn't get
it started again, despite many attempts. To me, it sounded like fuel
starvation. It would die as soon as we tried ti open the throttle
more. Mechanically, it sounded OK - no horrible rattles or anything...
I might have a poke around with it later and see if I can figure out
the problem - a blocked jet or a dirty fuel filter, perhaps..

I used unleaded petrol and ordinary two-stroke oil mixed at the ration
of 50:1. Hope this was correct.

Al D

[chris]

Post by Al D
On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 08:41:07 GMT, Ronald Raygun

Post by Ronald Raygun

Post by Al D
I guess it's hard to obtain spares for such an 18-yr old engine, is
it?

It's difficult to say. The design of these probably doesn't change
much over the years, apart from cosmetically. Even if it packs in
after a year or two, it's still good value at £60.

Thank you. Unfortunately, we had trouble getting it running well
today. It ran for about 3 minutes and then died, and we couldn't get
it started again, despite many attempts. To me, it sounded like fuel
starvation. It would die as soon as we tried ti open the throttle
more. Mechanically, it sounded OK - no horrible rattles or anything...
I might have a poke around with it later and see if I can figure out
the problem - a blocked jet or a dirty fuel filter, perhaps..
I used unleaded petrol and ordinary two-stroke oil mixed at the ration
of 50:1. Hope this was correct.
Al D

I have just spent a day on outboards. Getting the external parts of an old
mercury 2.5 freed up, replacing the tiller bolt after drilling out the
sheared one, only to discover the cooling water didn't run in the test tank.
Sheared a seized bolt on the propeller gearbox trying to get to the inside
of the leg but it is attached inside somehow probably the cooling pipe.

Worked on a seagull featherweight I had lying in the garage for years.
Symptoms same as yours i.e. it would start and die. Which usually electric's
and mechanical are ok and indicates fuel problem. Washed out the petrol
tank and filters, Stripped and cleaned the varnish like gunk and sediment
out of the carburettor and had to do it twice more to get rid of the junk
then it ran ok. Cooling water blocked but managed to reverse flush it and
cleared the waterways. Was it all worth it? Still like to know how to get
into the mercury cooling passages /leg

ChrisR

[Al D]

On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 09:40:55 +0100, "chris" <chris at yachtsmen.co.uk>

Post by chris
Symptoms same as yours i.e. it would start and die. Which usually electric's
and mechanical are ok and indicates fuel problem. Washed out the petrol
tank and filters, Stripped and cleaned the varnish like gunk and sediment
out of the carburettor and had to do it twice more to get rid of the junk
then it ran ok. Cooling water blocked but managed to reverse flush it and
cleared the waterways. Was it all worth it? Still like to know how to get
into the mercury cooling passages /leg

I think I know what's wrong with mine: I used 2x too much 2-stroke
oil! I'll clean the spark plug, try to drain the carb and fuel up with
correcly mixed fuel. Hopefully all will be okay. Gonna test it later
today, weather permitting.

Good luck,

AL D

[Nigel]

I use an electric thruster on my Coleman canoe (about 1/4 hp) and that's
plenty I get about 3-4 hours on a 80Ah battery.

[Al D]

Post by Nigel
I use an electric thruster on my Coleman canoe (about 1/4 hp) and that's
plenty I get about 3-4 hours on a 80Ah battery.

I've seen those electric motors locally, selling for about £200, new.
(40 lbs thrust, and made in the USA). The lack of noise seems
attractive.

Al D

[Floatything]

Post by Al D

Post by Nigel
I use an electric thruster on my Coleman canoe (about 1/4 hp) and that's
plenty I get about 3-4 hours on a 80Ah battery.

I've seen those electric motors locally, selling for about £200, new.
(40 lbs thrust, and made in the USA). The lack of noise seems
attractive.
Al D

The same could be said of paddles, which I expect have more 'hp' and are
distinctly cheaper :-)

Floatything

[Quilljar]

Well Al,
With your 220 metres of polyprop in a James Bond type suitcase, 14ft canoe
and outboard on a wooden support frame, you are going to be the
quintessential eccentric Englishman on the water this year. I daresay many a
photo album will have pictures of that strange sight seen at sea!